- This topic has 87 replies, 5 voices, and was last updated 8 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
I think Sanderson said you would have to “hack” the magic system to get AonDor to work off world.
In other words, RAFO😂
Sanderson is well known for his magic systems, but I feel like AonDor and all of the other magic systems that are only hinted at are all fairly boring. AonDor is quite generic for a magic system. It can do basically anything, and it has no special limitations except for location. Granted, this is his first published book, but having already read Mistborn, Stormlight, and Warbreaker, the magic here feels bland in comparison.
I felt the same. I don’t count it against him for the reasons you’ve already pointed out, I just decided to enjoy the story aspect more. There was the classic Sanderson unfolding with figuring out what was wrong with the Aons, which is always fun, it just didn’t really tell us why that was the case.
What is interesting is how many magic systems Sel has. There are at least three present in Elantris itself, and I believe that there are one or two more in the Emperor’s Soul, which I am probably going to read next. It makes me wonder how exactly magic systems are created. Scadrial has two shards, just like Sel, and it has one magic system related to each shard, plus one that is a mix. Even with the Shards combined, it didn’t change anything. Sel has the same amount of Shards and they similarly became combined, but there are many magic systems, and none of them seem explicitly related to either shard, except for Seons and Skazes, which are splinters of Devotion and Dominion, respectively.
Yeah, that’s a good point. The Aons and the other magic system in the bones at least seemed like branches of the same magic. Raoden assumed that they all came form the Dor, which I’m guessing is secretly just Devotion and Dominion, despite just being spoken of as non-sentient? It could be similar to Scadrial, where there’s the two, then the one that’s a mix, except it’s many combinations of the two systems, perhaps similar to twinborn, using both systems in combo, essentially making a new one, except it may be more subtle in this case.
Although Elantris is probably my least favorite Cosmere book I’ve read so far, I’m pretty excited for Elantris 2 and 3, because they will probably have a lot of Cosmere information. They will probably be a lot different from Elantris 1, considering how much more Cosmere information tends to be given in more recent books than the early ones.
Yeah, I’m excited t see where he goes with it. It was the beginning of the Cosmere, and Elantrians have been appearing everywhere, so it’s probably gonna be big moving forward.
I have now finished the Emperor’s Soul. I actually really liked it! Forgery is a pretty cool magic system. The book was very different from what I’m used to from Sanderson.
I liked it too! It’s interesting how much more connected to the cognitive realm it was, or at least how self aware it was about it.
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
In other words, RAFO😂
I wonder if you could use Feruchemy. Remember those disc things in BoM? What if you were able to store connection to Elantris and then tap it so that you could use AonDor anywhere?
Raoden assumed that they all came form the Dor, which I’m guessing is secretly just Devotion and Dominion, despite just being spoken of as non-sentient?
The backstory behind the Dor isn’t given in Elsntris, but can be scraped together from Arcanum Inbounded and a SA epigraph. There’s also been WoBs confirming this. Dominion and Devotion were splintered by Odium very early on. He was unpracticed at it, so it didn’t work as he had intended. His goal was for the shards’ power to become inaccessible, so he locked it in the Cognitive Realm. But the investiture of the two Shards mixed together and became the Dor, which is not sentient, as you said, but is essentially a combination of the two shards just as Harmony is. As a side note, the Dor has made the Selish cognitive realm very dangerous.
I’m guessing the weirdness of the Dor is related to the location-based magic system, but maybe not the number of them, because we do have one more example of a planet with multiple shards: Roshar. Roshar had two shards at first, and a third later on. If it followed Scadrial’s pattern, then it would have six (or maybe seven if there was one from all three shards) magic systems with Odium there. Instead, it only has one. It seems that the surgebinding used by the Knights Radiant is derived from Honor and Cultivation, because apparently Shardblades and plate are made of an alloy of their metals. Meanwhile, the Fused use a surgebinding derived from Odium. There are multiple ways to access it, but these are all the same magic system. We do know that there is a separate magic system called voidbinding, but we haven’t seen it yet. So it seems that magic systems are more complicated then there being one for each shard, plus a hybrid between them. Scadrial does work like this, but Sel has many magic systems, despite having only two shards, and Roshar has less magic systems then Shards.
I read Shadows for Silence last night. Next is Sixth of the Dusk. Then the only Cosmere books I have left will be the Lost Metal, Tress, Yumi, and Sunlit. I think that’s it.
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksOkay I just checked and that is everything, except the White Sands graphic novel. I think a full novel for White Sands is scheduled for the end of 2025, so I’ll probably just wait for that.
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksYes it is.
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksIt’s almost the end of the year, and all the secret projects were for this year.
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksI wonder if you could use Feruchemy. Remember those disc things in BoM? What if you were able to store connection to Elantris and then tap it so that you could use AonDor anywhere?
That would make a lot of sense. Scadrians are the first to discover space travel, right? That could explain Tress. Then the Elantrians in SH were simply in the cognitive realm of Scadrial.
The backstory behind the Dor isn’t given in Elsntris, but can be scraped together from Arcanum Inbounded and a SA epigraph. There’s also been WoBs confirming this. Dominion and Devotion were splintered by Odium very early on. He was unpracticed at it, so it didn’t work as he had intended. His goal was for the shards’ power to become inaccessible, so he locked it in the Cognitive Realm. But the investiture of the two Shards mixed together and became the Dor, which is not sentient, as you said, but is essentially a combination of the two shards just as Harmony is. As a side note, the Dor has made the Selish cognitive realm very dangerous.
Ahh, that makes sense. I was gonna ask if that was the moment Elantris fell, perhaps triggering the Chasm and stuff, but I just realized that the Dor was much more ancient in concept.
I’m guessing the weirdness of the Dor is related to the location-based magic system, but maybe not the number of them, because we do have one more example of a planet with multiple shards: Roshar. Roshar had two shards at first, and a third later on. If it followed Scadrial’s pattern, then it would have six (or maybe seven if there was one from all three shards) magic systems with Odium there. Instead, it only has one. It seems that the surgebinding used by the Knights Radiant is derived from Honor and Cultivation, because apparently Shardblades and plate are made of an alloy of their metals. Meanwhile, the Fused use a surgebinding derived from Odium. There are multiple ways to access it, but these are all the same magic system. We do know that there is a separate magic system called voidbinding, but we haven’t seen it yet. So it seems that magic systems are more complicated then there being one for each shard, plus a hybrid between them. Scadrial does work like this, but Sel has many magic systems, despite having only two shards, and Roshar has less magic systems then Shards.
That’s true. Sanderson originally intended to make 20 different magic systems for Roshar, but that’s when he came up with the “go deeper before you go farther” principle, so he backtracked. There is technically the Old Magic, which is regarded as if a magic system, but I would assume that even the StormFather could do that if it was what he was created to do, so it’s likely not even unique.
I read Shadows for Silence last night. Next is Sixth of the Dusk. Then the only Cosmere books I have left will be the Lost Metal, Tress, Yumi, and Sunlit. I think that’s it.
Shadows was interesting, if a little creepy. I was quite interested in the “Evil” which I’m assuming had to do with a shard splintering. Sixth of Dusk was cool too. It’s set way way into the future of the Cosmere, as are most of the SPs. All I got left is the rest of Warbreaker, Lost Metal, Rhythm, and Sunlit (plus White Sand). I’m not sure what you’ll think of Tress and Yumi, they are on the more whimsical side of Sanderson’s writings, but I think you’ll enjoy them, and there’s a lot of Cosmere stuff.
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
Shadows was interesting, if a little creepy. I was quite interested in the “Evil” which I’m assuming had to do with a shard splintering.
Yeah it was interesting. I’m not sure if the Evil is directly caused by a Shard splintering, but the shades are so it seems likely. Arcanum Unbounded mentions that a shard was shattered near Threnody, and it was confirmed in a WoB that that shard was Ambition, splintered by Odium. (Odium sure has a nasty track record. He murdered a quarter of the shards!)
Sixth of Dusk was cool too. It’s set way way into the future of the Cosmere, as are most of the SPs. All I got left is the rest of Warbreaker, Lost Metal, Rhythm, and Sunlit (plus White Sand). I’m not sure what you’ll think of Tress and Yumi, they are on the more whimsical side of Sanderson’s writings, but I think you’ll enjoy them, and there’s a lot of Cosmere stuff.
I’m definitely interested in reading some full length content about side planets. The SPs are full novels and not just novellas, right?
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksYeah it was interesting. I’m not sure if the Evil is directly caused by a Shard splintering, but the shades are so it seems likely. Arcanum Unbounded mentions that a shard was shattered near Threnody, and it was confirmed in a WoB that that shard was Ambition, splintered by Odium. (Odium sure has a nasty track record. He murdered a quarter of the shards!)
Yeah, Odium is reeking a whole lot of havoc, lol. Perhaps he’s a tad too passionate about his work?
I’m definitely interested in reading some full length content about side planets. The SPs are full novels and not just novellas, right?
Yeah, they’re full length novels, except for the 5 SP, but that’s not Cosmere.
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
Another thing interesting in Shadows for Silence is the silver. I think that’s the only place we’ve seen where silver is important. It seems that silver is sort of similar to aluminum, except that it seems to actually hurt the shades, whereas aluminum would presumably just block them. But if silver has some sort of effect on investiture, I wonder why nobody else in the Cosmere has developed any uses for it against investiture.
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksThat’s a good point. It could be the rarity of silver? I would assume that it’s commonplace, but perhaps not?
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
It’s definitely fairly common. In HoA Vin was held in silver shackles to prevent her using them. Sanderson actually considered silver being used instead of aluminum, but decided that aluminum would work better, because it would start out rare and then become more common. Maybe silver just isn’t viable against most investiture. I would guess that you must be able to affect it with Allomancy, or else they would have noticed. Maybe it’s mainly useful against cognitive shadows.
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksAnd now I’ve read Sixth of the Dusk. This one was definitely interesting. The aviar magic system is not clearly laid out, which is unusual, but pretty interesting. It’s also interesting how it seems that a lot of the creatures that inhabit First of the Sun can detect and send mental messages.
🏰 Fantasy Writer
✨ Magic System Creator
🎭 Character RPer
📚 Appreciator of BooksYeah, that makes sense. I wonder if Sanderson will come up with any specific reason of why different metals interact with investiture differently.
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.