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What do you mean by degree of competence? Is not all of history a game where we must incorporate the fact that things have bias? Is prediction just a guess? Is it not good to read things that we don’t agree with to escape the danger of bubble communities?
??? Did anything I said contradict any of those questions? Are you just stating the obvious to add to my point, or am I missing something?
(First I was joking. You did not. I do know people who probably don’t believe in quantum physics. Most of them are old though.
Second it is not determinism because we make the choices (or in a way have already made the choices (in a theoretical way)).
(Yeah, you mentioned that, I just wanted to make sure we were clear. Again, I will rant even when very unnecessary. I admit this to be something I should probably work on a bit. Sorry.
Interesting, so your suggesting that free will is not purely influenced by causation, nor by determinism, but by already making the choices in some form of preexistent individuality. Is that right? Makes sense.)
I had read some stuff that said they were probably neanderthals which would make sense.
(I did actually think about that. It does make sense. I’ve also heard theories that the Neanderthals were actually sons and daughters of Canaan, which also makes sense to me. Maybe it’s all three.)
I would say that nationalism is bad when you replace God with nation.
(Oh, for sure! That is a keystone when it comes to a nation. Once you remove God, or put something above God, then your removing the base of the whole system!)
I would have to disagree with you about some of your points. The first would be that I would point out that America is not God’s chosen land of freedom and that not all of the founding fathers were christians (some of them were freemasons which is not christianity). I would say that my only problem with American flag crosses is that sometimes they feel like they are putting America above/equal to God (which it is not). I think that otherwise they are meh (as in I don’t personally like them but feel they are only inherently a tier 3 issue (as this guy in a sermon I was listening to said)). (I would also point out that I disagree with additional books to the bible but I feel that is the exstent of where we will go with this (as said before I don’t really want to argue about this (I am just anticipating future arguments using additional books based on a quick wikipedia (I know, not the most reputable) search.)))
(Alright, I get it. You can chill my guy. I cannot refrain from my beliefs in my country, and I can tell you why if I must, but I understand why you point against it with a very objective finger. As for the Mason thing, I understand that as well, which I can also explain if you really will have me. I don’t care to discuss this however if I’m going to be deliberately told that I’m wrong about something. I’m completely fine with disagreement, and am completely fine with you believing that I’m very wrong about something, but I don’t feel the need to defend what I believe, because I believe it defends itself plenty well. Who told you that America is not God’s chosen land? A scripture? An angel? God? If not, please state your disagreement, but please don’t state something I believe in as false so matter-a-factly. I say this with the highest respect and humility. Perhaps I am wrong in my beliefs, and I would love to hear any of your thoughts on them, but I would like this to be a place where we can recognize our differences, but ultimately agree that we are all simply trying to strive to be closer to our Savior. Again, I’m sorry for my ranting, but this is something I feel strongly about (I know You’ve mentioned you don’t want to argue as well, so please don’t provoke an argument by telling someone that something they believe is false without any proof as to why. Disagree, tell them why, and maybe you’ll convince them, and perhaps they’ll change.). Yes, your right, some are likely saying that, but I don’t think all are, what someone implies by their apparel may be different from your interpretation. You may be totally right that it’s disrespectful. I say again though that I don’t think Christ cares about what we’re wearing, but how we are striving to draw closer to Him. I’m not saying that clothing doesn’t have anything to do with this. If your wearing a cross with the red white and blue, and you are thinking of that as a symbol that nation is equal or greater than God, then yes, I agree that’s a problem, because you are showing less devotion to God with such an implication. Either way though, as you mention, there are bigger problems in the world concerning respect and devotion to Christ. As for your thoughts on additional scripture, yeah, I know. I was simply pointing something out I thought was funny. As you say, we don’t need to get into it, though I would be happy to as long as we can be respectful.)
(I dislike these types of questions.)
*is sad*
None for now? (Is this a statement.)
Isn’t that a statement, and the other a question?
(If anything I’ve said has upset you in any way, I’m sorry. I believe us both to be good followers of Christ, and can continue to be good friends, and have good deep discussions, and sure with plenty of disagreements as well.)
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
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(Yes! Exactly! My friends said they were Christians but they were not very nice with debating me. Eventually I just said, hey I don’t think I want to talk about this anymore. And thankfully they stopped. I just have to say this has been a really nice place to talk with other writers especially because people don’t debate you for the most part even if they believe something completely different from you. Respect is such a nice thing to give people. Lol)
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Btw, I think it’s OK to have a civil debate as long as both parties aren’t frustrated during it like mine was. I’ve seen great debates and horrible debates. I just try to stay away from them as my experiences have not been the greatest.
(I was going through my list and reading plot summaries of musicals/plays when I came upon the Book of the Mormon musical after reading the plot summary I have the following questions)
Assuming you are a Mormon what is your opinion on The Book of the Mormon musical?
(I actually haven’t seen the Book of Mormon musical, though I do know that it was made by non-members making fun of it. And no, I am not Mormon actually, that guy died centuries ago, but I am a Member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Mormon is really just a slur, though it has deep roots, and many members use it unfortunately. We don’t like it because it has lead many to believe we worship Mormon, which we don’t. We like to emphasize that we really worship Jesus Christ. Mormon we believe to have been a great profit, but this is not his church).
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
- Rank: Knight in Shining Armor
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@otherworldlyhistorian and @thearcaneaxiom
(You guys are great debaters/discussers. Is very impressed Oh and I forgot to put my last message in parentheses. My bad! 😅😜)
@sarafini
(Thanks! I’ve just read some of your posts, and you make some great points as well!)
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
“(Mormon is really just a slur, though it has deep roots, and many members use it unfortunately. We don’t like it because it has led many to believe we worship Mormon, which we don’t. We like to emphasize that we really worship Jesus Christ. Mormon we believe to have been a great profit, but this is not his church).”
(I still can’t seem to get quoting on KP to work)
(Thanks for enlightening me I will not use that word now and will try to refer to your denomination (is that correct) as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (honestly I did not know there was a difference between the two terms beforehand) (sorry) (yeah I kind read the musical plot summary (I’ve been following a list based off of how likely different musicals/operas are to show up in quizbowl competitions) and was like this feels kind of offensive and I am not even a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (I am currently going to a southern baptist church (however I have been to many diffrent churches (of multiple denominations) this just happens to be the one in wich I feel like God has put me in the moment (Covid kind of caused my last chuch to fall apart so we had been looking around for a bit after that) but I personally use the term of an Ultra Protestant (this using the original meaning of the word (someone bases their beliefs about Christianity solely on the scripture in the bible) (I go to a heavily liberal school and there are many there who have a negative connotation to the word Christian so I have begun to use other words ie Jesus follower when first talking about my religious belief. I started saying ultra protestant after I talked to an atheist friend I have about my religious beliefs and he was like “so you are basically just an ultra protestant” and I liked the way it sounded.) so I wondered what someone from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints would think of the musical.)
(that was a bit rant like (I do like learning about religions/ religious sects though)
@sarafini
(I can agree respect is important my school just did this thing called One Small Step, It is were you get matched with a person of a different political viewpoint than yourself and then you have a discussion and try to connect as people despite your differing beliefs (it was really interesting and fun))
Would either of you be interested in checking this out?
(It is from a thing called secret church it is basically 6 1 hour sermons (although when they live-stream it (or when it is in person they are all together) where this preacher dude named David Platt (he was the president of the IMB (international mission board) for a bit) goes through the entire bible talking about a single topic. He does a different topic every year and government in relation to the Christians this was the 2020 one. His church is generally really good at talking about contemporary issues so I watch a good amount of their sermons just as extra bible time for myself. He is an evangelical Baptist and I don’t really think anything he says will contradict your beliefs Serafini (based on my limited knowledge of Reformed Baptist) as he is mostly just focused on talking about the Christians’ relationship to government. However, ArcaneAxiom I believe this will most likely contradict your opinion on something or another as he doesn’t observe the Book of Mormon (and I believe he mentioned in a different sermon that he believes Jehova Witness, Scientology, and, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints are not actually Christian) However It might be interesting to watch part of it to see some of my views on the subject of government and the church (I mean I feel like he does a pretty good job and it checks out with my personal readings)
(Also on a side note, I would suggest checking a sermon from Mike Kelsey about divisions within the church. I believe the core concepts can really be applied to any denomination.)
(I was going to show this really amazing Tim Keller sermon series on the book of Jonah but I couldn’t find it if I do I will tell you all)
(Also no pressure to look at any of those things just thought they might interest you guys)
(On a side note)
What are your favourite musicals (also include why)?
@sarafini
I very much dilike it when you have to split up a post because of links to get it to post on KP
(KP just disappeared my reply.
??? Did anything I said contradict any of those questions? Are you just stating the obvious to add to my point, or am I missing something?
Hmmm? Could I be posing obvious statements as questions?(Yeah, you mentioned that, I just wanted to make sure we were clear. Again, I will rant even when very unnecessary. I admit this to be something I should probably work on a bit. Sorry.
(You don’t need to apologize (if anyone needs to it is me but more on that later.) Is Ranting just our way of speech in this place where we can only speak in monologues?Interesting, so your suggesting that free will is not purely influenced by causation, nor by determinism, but by already making the choices in some form of preexistent individuality. Is that right? Makes sense.)
(✅)(Oh, for sure! That is a keystone when it comes to a nation. Once you remove God, or put something above God, then your removing the base of the whole system!)
(I am slightly confused here. Are you trying to say you need God for a good political structure? Then we would have to define a good political structure (and what level of separation of church and state are we talking about). I was talking in more of the sense that humans have an inherent need for a ‘god’ (I can explain this more if you want.) and that nationalism becomes a problem when you put your nation in that spot.)(Alright, I get it. You can chill my guy. I cannot refrain from my beliefs in my country, and I can tell you why if I must, but I understand why you point against it with a very objective finger. As for the Mason thing, I understand that as well, which I can also explain if you really will have me. I don’t care to discuss this however if I’m going to be deliberately told that I’m wrong about something. I’m completely fine with disagreement, and am completely fine with you believing that I’m very wrong about something, but I don’t feel the need to defend what I believe, because I believe it defends itself plenty well. Who told you that America is not God’s chosen land? A scripture? An angel? God? If not, please state your disagreement, but please don’t state something I believe in as false so matter-a-factly. I say this with the highest respect and humility. Perhaps I am wrong in my beliefs, and I would love to hear any of your thoughts on them, but I would like this to be a place where we can recognize our differences, but ultimately agree that we are all simply trying to strive to be closer to our Savior. Again, I’m sorry for my ranting, but this is something I feel strongly about (I know You’ve mentioned you don’t want to argue as well, so please don’t provoke an argument by telling someone that something they believe is false without any proof as to why. Disagree, tell them why, and maybe you’ll convince them, and perhaps they’ll change.). Yes, your right, some are likely saying that, but I don’t think all are, what someone implies by their apparel may be different from your interpretation. You may be totally right that it’s disrespectful. I say again though that I don’t think Christ cares about what we’re wearing, but how we are striving to draw closer to Him. I’m not saying that clothing doesn’t have anything to do with this. If your wearing a cross with the red white and blue, and you are thinking of that as a symbol that nation is equal or greater than God, then yes, I agree that’s a problem, because you are showing less devotion to God with such an implication. Either way though, as you mention, there are bigger problems in the world concerning respect and devotion to Christ. As for your thoughts on additional scripture, yeah, I know. I was simply pointing something out I thought was funny. As you say, we don’t need to get into it, though I would be happy to as long as we can be respectful.)
Ok, so the first thing I will say is sorry. I didn’t mean to make you feel that way. I should have not tried to cagily talk around this topic. In my (previously mentioned) Wikipedia research on The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints I read that in some of their added stuff, they believed that the U.S.A. is God’s chosen nation of freedom. Please realize that I don’t believe in those additional scriptures and hear me out before instantly refuting what I say using them. Now for what I should have said:First, the bible (that I believe in (which is the bible)) does not say that America is God’s chosen nation of freedom.
Second, there is the founding fathers thing. Some of them were Christians but others were and I know freemasons. The freemasons were not Christians. If you want to discuss this more I am happy to. (I am also not saying that all of them were freemasons (James Madison is an example but others like George Washington were).
Thirdly, scripture says that we are not citizens of this world. (John 17:16, Hebrews 13:14, 1 Peter 2:11, Philippians 3:20, and other stuff from the bible).
(also on a barely related note here is a shameless plug for this really interesting (kind of) sermon (it is just a really long multi-part sermon) about God, government, and the gospel. (Link ))
As for the second addressed topic (on flag crosses) when I said a Tier 3 issue I was meaning issues that are smaller and more personalized (like (to reference a common debate around here) reading Harry Potter) and that really shouldn’t divide a church. It is a reference to this sermon (the Tier 3 issue thing not crosses or harry potter (the pastor has a point about divisions within the church)) (Sermon).
However, I do demur with your point that ” there are bigger problems in the world concerning respect and devotion to Christ” (if this is what you mean (which it could not be. (The structure of the paragraph confused me.)) because I do think that toxic nationalism is a really big problem. In case you have been living under a conservative rock (🙃) Christians have been increasingly associated with the political (far) right. It is really interesting talking to some of the non-Christians I know who generally know that we believe in a guy named Jesus who died to save people but usually have other misconceptions.
Hopefully, that makes up for my not-so-great post earlier.)
Isn’t that a statement, and the other a question?
Then is this a question. (Excuse my potential rulebreaking but it is for the sake of inquisitivity.)(more questions)
What do you think it would be like if we learned that quantum mechanical physics was wrong?
Through darkness,
light shines brightest(Hey, you referenced the same ones as me. It is almost like we are related or something 🙃.)
Through darkness,
light shines brightest@folith-feolin @otherworldlyhistorian
(So that was severely depressing. I was too committed to finishing my post last night, that I ended up typing it up until 2 in the morning, but I didn’t back it up, and it got deleted when I tried posting it😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭. *Note to self: go to sleep*)
(Ok, from the beginning again)
(I’ve listened to the first sermon you linked, it was really interesting, and I never really came across anything I disagreed with yet. The thing is that many think that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is a completely different religion from Christianity, but we are Christian in our very core. Yes, there are many differences, but there are many more similarities than many assume. He gave a very strict definition of Christian: “A Bible believing, Gospel embracing, follower of Jesus”, and referenced that definition multiple times in the first sermon, and that is what my Church is fundamentally. I didn’t hear him mention the Church of Jesus Christ of latter day Saints yet, but if he does mention it, and says we aren’t Christian, then he’ll need to change his definition, but I think that would be missing the point he was making in this sermon. It was really neat though, and he addressed some really big things concerning Christianity in a modern world, and borders between different denominations. I look forward to listening to the others!)
(Thank you for understanding)
Is Ranting just our way of speech in this place where we can only speak in monologues?
Is ranting the optimal way of speech within monologues?
(I am slightly confused here. Are you trying to say you need God for a good political structure? Then we would have to define a good political structure (and what level of separation of church and state are we talking about). I was talking in more of the sense that humans have an inherent need for a ‘god’ (I can explain this more if you want.) and that nationalism becomes a problem when you put your nation in that spot.)
(I think we may actually agree on this, just in slightly different ways. I was thinking about the ethics within a political structure. Many political systems start with a religious bases of right and wrong, but eventually will deconstruct that original premise, while also trying to preserve the original moral system. Trying to preserve some moral code with no God leads people to either put something else in His place, or to fully deconstruct the system, both causing collapse. This has resulted many times throughout history, and is currently happening. I’m pretty sure this is what you were basically describing. I would love to talk about it more if you want, though I’m not too much of a political buff.)
Ok, so the first thing I will say is sorry. I didn’t mean to make you feel that way. I should have not tried to cagily talk around this topic. In my (previously mentioned) Wikipedia research on The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints I read that in some of their added stuff, they believed that the U.S.A. is God’s chosen nation of freedom. Please realize that I don’t believe in those additional scriptures and hear me out before instantly refuting what I say using them.
(Thanks again for understanding. And sorry if I came off harsh at all. I’m all for disagreement, and I love having my faith be challenged, but only if done with neutral respect. I appreciate that your trying to learn more about my Church online, however I will warn you that it is very unreliable, comically so even. It is a lot better than it was though. Please know that I was never refuting you, I was just explaining that It seemed to me that I was being refuted. I like to consider other views seriously, and I will continue to do so including this cases. Through challenging my faith, I refine it, and gain a deeper, stronger testimony than I ever would have otherwise, allowing me to draw closer to the truth and therefore Christ.)
First, the bible (that I believe in (which is the bible)) does not say that America is God’s chosen nation of freedom.
(This is true, but I bear a testimony of additional revelation from God through scripture, which bears record of this. If sought out, you can find points in the Bible that I believe prophesize of this additional scripture, (I think of Isaiah specifically, I can get more into this if you want) and this additional testament of Jesus Christ, also bears record of the truth of the Bible. They are in companionship.)
Second, there is the founding fathers thing. Some of them were Christians but others were and I know freemasons. The freemasons were not Christians. If you want to discuss this more I am happy to. (I am also not saying that all of them were freemasons (James Madison is an example but others like George Washington were).
(Sure. By my understanding of Masonry (which is limited), it isn’t Christian, but many Masons can be Christians. George Washington for example was a Mason, but also an Anglican Christian. Masonry is more of a philosophy than a religion, though it does have a unified belief in a creator. I would love to discuss this more, because I don’t know too much about the Masons. Either way though, even if some of the fathers denied the Christ, which I don’t think any did (Please correct me if I’m wrong), differing beliefs allowed for the Freedom of Religion to be established, a right I believe in greatly. It allows us to live on a higher law, we are not pushed to the Savior, but it is instead our right to choose to walk to Him, or to deny Him. This obviously is not unique to the US now, but it is a fundamental part of it.)
Thirdly, scripture says that we are not citizens of this world. (John 17:16, Hebrews 13:14, 1 Peter 2:11, Philippians 3:20, and other stuff from the bible).
(Great verses! Thanks for sharing them. They each allude to our eternal nature, and how we should not be of this world. This is a common point within my Church, we often put it as: We are in the world, but don’t have to be of the world. I don’t think that this at all contradicts the idea the American soil is God’s chosen land of freedom. I feel that you probably misunderstand what we are implying with that. I am a American citizen in this temporal state, but first and foremost, I am a Child of God, my country does not compare to that to any degree. This is a worldwide Church, and we aren’t saying we are better or entitled in any way. Everyone here on earth is called of God, we simply believe that America is chosen to be influential for forwarding His plan.)
As for the second addressed topic (on flag crosses) when I said a Tier 3 issue I was meaning issues that are smaller and more personalized (like (to reference a common debate around here) reading Harry Potter) and that really shouldn’t divide a church. It is a reference to this sermon (the Tier 3 issue thing not crosses or harry potter (the pastor has a point about divisions within the church)) (Sermon).
(Right, and I think that’s what I was understanding. It is a matter of personal choice, and each individual’s relationship with God. Is that right?)
However, I do demur with your point that ” there are bigger problems in the world concerning respect and devotion to Christ” (if this is what you mean (which it could not be. (The structure of the paragraph confused me.)) because I do think that toxic nationalism is a really big problem. In case you have been living under a conservative rock (🙃) Christians have been increasingly associated with the political (far) right. It is really interesting talking to some of the non-Christians I know who generally know that we believe in a guy named Jesus who died to save people but usually have other misconceptions.
(Sorry if I didn’t explain perfectly. I was referring to the US flag on crosses, not nationalism in general. And no, I haven’t been living under any conservative rocks. I’ve lived the majority of my life in Oregon until recently, a state that is extremely leftist. That being said, as for America specifically, despite that I was only referencing the flag thing, I actually don’t think that toxic Nationalism is the biggest issue, in fact it’s the opposite. Far left is now making claims like the US was founded on Fascism (Which it wasn’t), and are taking any opportunity to discredit the constitution and its precepts. Because far left has most control over the media within the US, a lot of far right has simply lost hope in the nation, and are looking to get out. So I think that the US could actually stand to have a little more nationalism right now on both sides, not in it’s current state, but in it’s original values of freedom, and in the constitution (Yes, I know, there’s many countless atrocities done within the US that is hypocritical towards the idea of freedom, but again, those are the faults of man, not the nation their supposed to represent. Many could say the same thing about Christianity, but those are the faults of man, not the religion their supposed to represent). I’m not saying that toxic nationalism isn’t an issue. In fact, I think what your calling nationalism is occurring, but not really reflected towards any nation as much, but other things instead within the US. This is just what I’ve been seeing as someone on the inside.)
Hopefully, that makes up for my not-so-great post earlier.)
(It really does, thanks again for understanding. I really do want to hear your thoughts, I just won’t participate if I’m only going to be told I’m wrong without any proper proof that I’m wrong. Thanks for all of your thoughts, you’ve made some excellent points! I’m glad we can have a healthy discussion on these things!)
Then is this a question.
*roles up in a ball in panic*
What do you think it would be like if we learned that quantum mechanical physics was wrong?
(Good question. The problem is that quantum mechanics is undeniable, because we can make real world observations with experimentation. You can even do things like the two slit experiment in your own household. What is more of an open question is as to what theory that describes quantum mechanics is true. So what you would be asking is what if all those theories, even the most reasonable ones are simply false. This could be potentially a good thing for general relativity, where a whole new theory would need to be come-up with, that will actually tie well with general relativity, therefore creating a potential unified theory of everything. The issue is that these sort of theories are still very hard to test properly, as they often concern things like extra dimensions, and particles that are not yet known to exist. Either way though, it would push us to be closer to the truth, even if that means we need to tear down our whole understanding of physics and start from scratch.)
Do we all live on a potato, a donut, or a pringle?
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
(Hey sorry for not getting back to you sooner! I was in bed sick and my brain was certainly not in the mood for deep discussions in question form! I’m feeling much better now, so we’ll see how this goes.)
Is geometry, as well as the rest of mathematics, not a puzzle piece of the nature of our fundamental reality? Do these things not point to God?
(Geometry is definitely a puzzle piece to reality. (love the pun there.)) Do not all parts of nature point us to God, since He created them?
Is that not what my KP name suggests I search for? (I am the Arcane Axiom, arcane meaning mysterious, and axiom meaning base fundamental truth by which all other truth is derived. I want to understand the true nature of our universe at the most fundamental level, I want to learn the mysteries of God, and I feel math is at least a piece of that.)
Indeed it seems likely, which your well thought out name attests to; are you searching for the mysteries of God, or to have a relationship with Him in some way? And are those two things connected? Can you have one without the other? (Whoops, I’m going down a rabbit trail here.)
Is this in like manner to the question as to whether or not Adam had a belly button?
Is it different because spoken language is something you have to learn, unlike a physical feature of our bodies which is given to us?
Did God speak to Adam in His own tongue that He taught to Adam? What are the tongues of angels? Could they be phonetic, are they inclusive of all informational media’s, like thought? When God asked Adam to name all the animals, was it maybe not verbally spoken, but instead, could Adam perhaps simply understand divine command? Then perhaps he named the animals, and that is where phonetic speech came from? Could this sudden speculation be in any way close to the truth?
Is is also possible that all of this is speculation and this is one of the many questions which we will never know the answer to in this world? (Although it is fun to speculate!!)
You find languages fascinating? (Me too! I noticed your sister’s Quenya greeting!) What languages have you studied? Do you conlang at all?
(Awesome! I’ve studied some Spanish, French and Hebrew in the past, and am currently learning Polish. I’ve attempted to create a few words of conlang but found it’s hard enough learning an existing language never mind one that doesn’t even exist yet. 😉 ) Which have you studied?
(In my theology, I actually believe in an eternal progression, where we can eventually become as God (I understand this is actually not a common thing amongst most Christianity, I hope that it doesn’t generate any frustration). Either way though, I’m glad we see eye to eye that enlightenment to some degree will come to us in the next life!)
(Oh so you must be Mormon! That’s very interesting. I believe that the souls who trust in Jesus will receive a new and better “body” after they die, but not become as God. Nope, no frustration 😉 Thanks for being considerate though. Some people get really bothered about people who have different doctrines and can’t discuss things without getting into verbal fist fights, but I don’t agree with that. There’s always something you can learn from everyone, and just because people disagree doesn’t mean they should always be fighting.)
For questions to be infinite in that sense, wouldn’t they have to get larger and larger and more specific? Otherwise, wouldn’t there be, though cosmic in scale, a strictly finite amount of questions one could ask? Or is that question only meaningful in a strictly digital language sense, like all earth languages? Could there exist a spoken analogue language, and not only by a computer? Would the finite or infinite nature of questions depend purely on how one defines a question in a pure informational transaction sense?
Maybe we need to first define what a question is then, as the name of this honorable forum hints?
(Fair point. I say personal because not everyone will interpret scripture the same, causing diverging beliefs and theologies. Of course (at least I hope), we can all agree that there is a objective truth concerning things like theology. And I think we should all seek that truth out, but ultimately, because of our imperfect nature at this time, different theologies arise.) Ultimately however, as long as we are striving to draw closer to Him, who cares about the specifics?
(Yes you are totally right! We all interpret the details of scripture a bit differently, and most of the time that’s not a problem because like you said, hopefully we can all agree on the ultimate objective truths.)
(I still personally believe these things still to be important, but it doesn’t matter where you are as long as your facing Him.)
(Yes. Me too. There is only one Way to the Father, and as long as we are in that Way, we’re going to be ok in the end. John 14:6)
(Absolutely, that’s the best way to gain spiritual knowledge! Or any knowledge for that manner. I was simply pointing out that scripture should be the primary resource for truth, not a man’s theory, even if it is based off of scripture, which is exactly what you already point out here.)
(Awesome. Thumbs up. I feel like we’re needlessly going in circles a bit here so will leave this at that. 🙂 Great minds think alike.)
(Yep! “…Ask, and ye shall receive, knock, and it shall be opened unto you…”. I would love to share! I’m actually a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, so I aught to mention we actually believe in some additional scripture given from God in companionship to the Bible, such as The Book of Mormon(I’m not looking to start a debate either, so I hope bringing this up is fine with you).
(Yep!)
(What is highly stressed is our agency (free will). We believe that the ability to choose is a sacred gift from God. With this gift, we can either choose to follow Him, or to not do that. Either way however, He loves each and every one of us regardless of our choice, and gives each of us an opportunity to learn of Him, and choose Him, either in this life or the next.)
Wait so you believe even if we don’t choose God in this life, we’ll have a second chance?
(An idea similar to Molinisim I’ve sometimes pondered is that God simply knows every possible choice we could make, whether or not He knows which one we will make, I don’t know, but maybe He sets things up in such a way such that He can be ready for every eventuality. Again, this is only speculation, and I won’t be satisfied until it’s been revealed to be true or false to me. I will say though, that I do believe that Heavenly Father is a God bound by natural law, but I respect and understand the belief that saying that somehow limits God in some way though.)
(You know I’ve thought of that too.) Can God limit Himself? (If so, I don’t see why its a problem. He could decide to limit Himself to the natural laws that He made.)
What about you? What are some of your thoughts and beliefs on the matter?
(I tend to take the Molinist position on the subject of free will and God’s divine decree. I already discussed it earlier so I won’t go into detail again but one of the reasons why I appreciate it is because of how mind boggling it is to think about. It puts me in awe of how powerful God is. His knowledge is truly greater than we can comprehend! Rom. 11:34)
(This has been a really enlightening conversation. I don’t often study different theologies, so it’s been really fascinating to hear about some!)
(Same here! Thanks for making it possible!)
He must increase, but I must decrease.
(With what I’ve said, I don’t mean to start an argument, a debate, or anything. I’ve glanced over y’all’s conversations and found it fascinating, actually. I just wanted to give my opinion. 🙂 [Which happened to take on the form of a rant. 😂])
(Thanks for the rant! 😉 Praise God. His glory is beyond words!)
Did you feel things heating up or something? (I thought we were staying cool. Thanks for the reminder though! It’s important that we can have discussions without going nuts.)
He must increase, but I must decrease.
(When reading over the fascinating discussion between you and the twins I came across you’re opinion on what you prefer being called. And I realized I had called you you’re un-preferred title in my post. Sorry about that and thanks for educating us! Please know that I was not trying to be rude, that’s just the title that I knew your church by.
By the way I really like your take on nationalism. I wish more people thought like that and were willing to actually take a stand against the left.)
He must increase, but I must decrease.
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