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Is it (ever) morally acceptable to tell someone that their religion is false or that their god doesn’t exist?
Y’know, I’m wondering if it might actually be worse to not explain that their beliefs are false.
But you must go about it tactfully. Saying stuff like that straight out will probably get you in trouble more likely than not. You also can’t just, say, barge into a Muslim mosque or Hindu temple or whatever and yell “Your god(s) don’t exist!!!” One on one is so much better for these kinds of conversation, and they’ll be more likely to listen if you have good relations with them.
That, and there’s better ways to say it that everyone else has already discussed, so I’m not gonna go into that.
Sometimes you don’t even have to say such a thing. Once you present the Gospel to them, they might figure it out on their own (well, TECHNICALLY not on their own cause it’s God explaining it to them, but it’s between them and Him and you don’t really have a say in that)
"When in doubt, eat cheese crackers."-me to my charries who don't even know about cheese crackers
@loopylin @power @theducktator @savannah_grace2009 @ellette-giselle @trailblazer @elishavet-pidyon @the_lost-journal
Thank you all for your thoughtful answers! (Except for Power. You just tricked me into reading the Bible lol)
I do agree with most of you that there are some situations where it would be unacceptable or just distasteful to tell someone that their religion is false or that their god doesn’t exist. And positive preaching–saying what is true instead of stating bluntly what is incorrect–seems to be the most used method by early Christians such as Paul, and would be a good strategy to imitate. I mean, who’s going to walk up to some stranger and be like:
But at the same time, I do think it’s morally acceptable to say it as *gently* as possible in some situations. For me, telling someone straight up “your religion is false and its practices are sinful” would not be the most loving way to put it. However, I think sometimes it’s necessary to say something along the lines of “__ doesn’t exist” or “__ is a lie.” I can think of some cases in which such statements are urgently needed. For example, if someone is immediately about to do something horrible to themselves or others because of something false that they believe, it would be cruel not to take equally immediate action in a last-minute effort to save them or others from unnecessary suffering. But that is an extreme example.
Overall, however distasteful or blunt it might be, I think that it is a fundamental human right to be able to say whatever we want as long as it doesn’t infringe upon the rights of others, and telling someone that their religion is false (without coercing them, forcing them to do anything, etc.) doesn’t really come into conflict with their rights.
So basically, I think it’s morally acceptable to be direct in some circumstances, that in most circumstances it would be acceptable to state the truth without directly and bluntly condemning the lie, and that in certain circumstances it would not be the loving thing to do and would therefore not be morally acceptable. *shugs* that’s the best way I can put my personal opinion anyways.
The reason I was asking was because my religion teacher, at my Catholic school, was insisting that it is never okay to tell someone that there religion is false or that their god isn’t real. (This teacher has a pattern of saying weird things like “Buddhism is the religion that makes the most sense” and stuff) Although I can see how such a sentence could be part of a broader and more nuanced concept, I felt compelled speak up and point out that this is not true of all circumstances.
It was then revealed that her point of view did not consider any exceptions at all.
Hence began a long discussion which would later be described as an “incident” by the administration.
I was really curious as to the opinions of Keepers. After all, it is a really good question, because the Christian faith necessarily involves an attempt to spread the gospel. Knowing how one might go about this is essential.
…do y’all want me to keep posting random questions on here at random intervals
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Pray, thou shalt simply add ketchup unto the mac'n'cheese.
Religion teachers are weird all together! My friend’s religion teacher said that if you commit suicide you immediately go to hell (which idk if that is true or false, I am unsure) but my friend raised her hand and said “my uncle committed suicide.” (which is sadly true) and instead of her religion teacher being like “oh, I am so sorry for you,” She just said “Then he’s in hell!” and continued to teach the lesson. And for me, I was upset because I was having memories of the time my dog died (it happens from time to time, I think I am still in the grieving process… my dog died years ago tho) so I asked if animals go to heaven, and she was immediately like “No.” and she said if you have lost any pets you never see them again.
So idk what is wrong with religion teachers… Whoa, that was a little heavy 😓
"We love the sinner, but hate the sin."-The other mother (Coraline)
Just saw this now, is it ok if I answer or no? It’s okay if not.
“Our house is full of ducks!!!!”
Yeah. I hate to generalize, but I’ve had a few weird experiences with religion teachers. I think that post-secondary education and teacher’s college are kind of indoctrinating students, or at least are presenting information and training from a biased perspective.
Once, a substitute was teaching religion. She read the bible verse “nothing is impossible for God.” She then said that it was a metaphor and that God can’t actually do anything. I spoke up in polite disagreement, and (unlike my current religion teacher) she tried to understand my point of view and to disprove it by asking open questions. She actually thanked me for bringing a different perspective to the class, so although it began badly the event as a whole turned out well. It also created unity between myself and other students, such as one muslim girl who later told me that she agreed with everything I had said. So these can be learning opportunities, and opportunities for polite discussions, but only if the teacher and the students are willing to allow that to happen.
Pray, thou shalt simply add ketchup unto the mac'n'cheese.
A RELIGION teacher? Wow.
…do y’all want me to keep posting random questions on here at random intervals
Sure!
Oh my goodness. My dad says that in general animals don’t go to heaven, but a beloved pet would.
I shall be a vestibule of unhampered sanity.
Once, a substitute was teaching religion. She read the bible verse “nothing is impossible for God.” She then said that it was a metaphor and that God can’t actually do anything. I spoke up in polite disagreement, and (unlike my current religion teacher) she tried to understand my point of view and to disprove it by asking open questions. She actually thanked me for bringing a different perspective to the class, so although it began badly the event as a whole turned out well. It also created unity between myself and other students, such as one muslim girl who later told me that she agreed with everything I had said. So these can be learning opportunities, and opportunities for polite discussions, but only if the teacher and the students are willing to allow that to happen.
That is true, you cannot generalize everyone into one category, or a group of people into one category. (Besides the obvious one that God loves us) But religion teachers are a little,… ehhh…. sometimes. My current religion teachers is open to a friendly argument and does answer many questions I have without disrespect! And I am glad that turned out better for you in the end!
My mom is quit the opposite. She says all animals go to heaven, and believes they have a soul, but a different kind of soul. Not one Jesus died for, but still a soul. She says that since they are God’s beloved creatures, then they would also make it to the gates! And tbh, no offense to you or your dad, but that doesn’t make much sense… Why would on animal be allowed, but the other isn’t? And would it be for only beloved pets? Like what makes an animal a beloved pet? Just some questions I have.
"We love the sinner, but hate the sin."-The other mother (Coraline)
@theducktator @the_lost-journal
Huh. I dunno–I used to insist that animals go to heaven, but now my opinion has changed. The Catholic Catechism defines “heaven” as follows (and I know that Kefa is Catholic but that our Most Esteemed Feathered One is not, but I’m just explaining my own views):
This perfect life with the Most Holy Trinity — this communion of life and love with the Trinity, with the Virgin Mary, the angels and all the blessed — is called “heaven.” Heaven is the ultimate end and fulfillment of the deepest human longings, the state of supreme, definitive happiness.
Animals cannot partake in the ultimate end and fulfillment of the deepest human longings. However, perhaps they will exist in the new Heaven and Earth described in the Bible. They just couldn’t participate in heaven in the same kind of way that humans can in our unique communion with Christ.
I hope that makes sense. Also, I sound terribly official when talking about something almost trivial like “will my dog be in heaven?” I don’t know where the university professor syndrome came from XD
Pray, thou shalt simply add ketchup unto the mac'n'cheese.
I guess a beloved pet would be one that is loved. You will see your dog again, but our friends who keep and slaughter their chickens wouldn’t see them again. I think it would extend to other loved animals too. Like I wonder if I will see the sick house finch I tried to help but failed to heal a few years ago.
Why would on animal be allowed, but the other isn’t?
To my understanding, it would be because heaven is for humans, and consequently good things that we love will be there. I think this applies to animals and inanimate objects both. The inanimate object question has come up more at our house then the animal one because we’ve never had a pet.
Animals cannot partake in the ultimate end and fulfillment of the deepest human longings. However, perhaps they will exist in the new Heaven and Earth described in the Bible. They just couldn’t participate in heaven in the same kind of way that humans can in our unique communion with Christ.
I think that’s pretty close to what I’m saying. Like, some might exist there, but it’s not the same as the way humans would.
I shall be a vestibule of unhampered sanity.
That is interesting about the Catechism, and makes me wonder. But I never truly trust the Catechism, mainly because (unlike the Bible) it was made all from human understanding and perspective. Like how in the first Catechism it said it was okay to pray for the death of your enemies… what..? That is not at all true. But that doesn’t mean everything in the Catechism is false. It is just something to keep in mind.
I sound terribly official
Those few words make you sound terribly British! If I do say so myself. Oh well, top of the morning to you, and have a splendid day! 😂
hm, I see what you mean. But at the same time, there have been people whom claim to have seen heaven, or was giving a vision of heaven. And they would describe seeing animals. So idk. But I find it funny on how this who’ll thing started by me bringing up something my religion teacher said… And if you guys were trying to comfort me, thanks, but I am not too upset by it currently. But I am sure some time soon I will have random nostalgia and be all depressed… but thanks guys.
"We love the sinner, but hate the sin."-The other mother (Coraline)
Way to go for standing up for what you believe even if it has put you in a pickle! I was homeschooled up until my senior year, so the only religion teacher I had was my mom lol. But in the one year that I was in public school I had some disagreements with one teacher- fortunately he was very open-minded and we were able to have healthy discussions, and I actually respect him a lot even though we have such differing points of view. But for a Catholic school? To have a “religion” teacher that’s not teaching from a Catholic perspective? It’s sad how private schools can have teachers like that. There is a private Christian school close to where I live (not Catholic, but Mennonite) and one of the teachers got fired for using tarot cards and other witchcraft things in the classroom. But anyway that’s a bit of a rabbit hole….
"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
It’s actually a publicly funded Catholic school, so not private, but all the same.
It’s sad how private schools can have teachers like that. There is a private Christian school close to where I live (not Catholic, but Mennonite) and one of the teachers got fired for using tarot cards and other witchcraft things in the classroom. But anyway that’s a bit of a rabbit hole…
Yeah…it is sad. I don’t think teachers should be using their positions of authority in order to teach anything but the curriculum. They have been trusted with the education of young people, and have been employed by a religious school which parents have chosen in order to give their children a religious education. *sighs* it’s not rocket science…
There is one teacher, not a religion class teacher but music, and a kid went up to her and asked whether the kid could bring her tarot cards to school so the teacher could do a reading or something. (I don’t understand these things and hope I never will…) The teacher was happy to say yes. I’m not proud to say that I didn’t do anything about it.
Pray, thou shalt simply add ketchup unto the mac'n'cheese.
Like how in the first Catechism it said it was okay to pray for the death of your enemies… what..?
Some of the Psalms are like that, so I wouldn’t say it’s never true. Most of the time it is best to pray for their repentance though.
I shall be a vestibule of unhampered sanity.
Really? Well to be fair there might be a miss translation. Or it could need history to go along side it. 🤷♂️ Or at the same time it could be actually what it says. the Bible can be wild to us sometimes. (For we are just mere humans.)
"We love the sinner, but hate the sin."-The other mother (Coraline)
They’re called the Imprecatory Psalms. Psalms 59 and 83 for example.
I shall be a vestibule of unhampered sanity.
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