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Okay, so I’m reading and absolutely loving ‘The Count of Monte Cristo’ right now, and even those of you who haven’t read the book probably know the main theme is vengeance. (I haven’t finished it yet, so no spoilers please!) 😛
Vengeance is a very basic human passion, and all of us struggle with it on some level. It can be as simple as wanting to get the last word in an argument over who got to a seat first.
Anyway, since it is such a basic human passion and practically everyone struggles with it, I was wondering how we are to go about having elements of vengeance in our stories and yet not promoting the seeking of vengeance. Because a desire for revenge can support an entire story and make it awfully wonderful— ‘The Count of Monte Cristo’ is shaping up to be that way. But in the end, we don’t want to leave our reader inspired to go out and seek vengeance.
There are stereotypes of vengeance as there are stereotypes of everything, and like everything else vengeance can be ill done. Like the stereotype where the villain kills someone the protagonist loves, or otherwise hurts the protagonist, and the protagonist sets out on a quest for revenge. This can be well done (as I’m seeing as I progress in ‘Monte Cristo’) but it can also be done badly. Yes, I’m looking at you, Eragon.
So how do we have elements of vengeance in our stories and leave the reader with a satisfying conclusion, yet not promote the seeking of vengeance?
Why does the hero have to slay the villain out of a thirst for revenge?
Why does it always have to be that way?Whahahahaha!!!! You are doomed to be a Cristo fan. No one can escape!
Alright I’m back to normal now.
I’ll answer your last questions first. The hero (let us say protagonist rather) need not kill, but something drastic must happen if he goes through with his vengeance, for horrors reap horrors.
As for not promoting vengeance while using it, there are numerous was to do it. The basic thing though is that he either must be so broken by the harvest of his rage that he repents or somebody else must learn something to connection with his vengeance. (Say the wronged man takes out his vengeance by killing the one who wronged him and then the son of the dead man must learn to forgive him.)
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By the way, where are you in the book?
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Vengeance doesn’t always need to involve killing. Sometimes the Bad Guy will let the Good Guy live to they will suffer the same loss the Bad Guy suffered…at least I think I’ve read or seen a story like that. That could actually be an interesting storyline for a good guy; he forgives the bad guy and lets him live, but in reality the bad guy is so miserable for whatever reason (loss, defeat) that that is punishment enough. They may even go and kill themselves (looking at you, Javert).
INTJ - Inhumane. No-feelings. Terrible. Judgment and doom on everyone.
sshhh. She’s going to read les mis too.
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I am almost halfway through it— with Franz d’Epinay and Albert de Morcerf at the Carnival of Rome, just after Albert got caught by Luigi Vampa and Franz is taking the Count with him to effect Albert’s release. And yes, I’m afraid I’m hooked for life. Don’t you dare ask me who my favorite character is— there is, and only will ever be, one answer, and if you can’t guess who that is you can’t claim to have read the book. 😛
I like those suggestions, Daeus. The one when he is so broken by the horror of his completed revenge and repents is fairly common— can you think of any ways to spice it up and make it a little less typical? A little different? I can’t right off the top of my head— what do you think?
I also think that horrors should reap horrors— evil will find its own reward in the end. The thing is to go about it in a way that doesn’t leave the reader feeling all smug and satisfied that the protagonist finally ‘got back at those wretched bad guys and it serves them right too!’ You want them to be satisfied that justice was administered, but you don’t want them to set down the book with a sadistic smile on their smug little face and revel in the protagonist’s awful vengeance. You want them to set down the book with a serious expression and look at the protagonist and think ‘Wow… he fought so hard to obtain that end, and in the end he wasn’t really made happy by achieving it. Satisfied, yes, but happy? I don’t think so.’
Anyway…Okay, all three of us must have been posting at the same time!
Yes, I am going to read Les Mis. Thanks, Hope. I’ll try and forget that. 😛
Current twist options available are:
1. The wronged person could take vengeance on the wrong people
2. Or he could accidentally take vengeance on someone he loves … and then find out (Already claimed. Refer to my novel to come out in I have no idea when.)
3. Or his vengeance plots could backfire and nearly (or actually) destroy him
4. Or he might simply be so compelled by the opposites of vengeance (love, reconciliation, etc) that he abandons all his former desires. (In which case of course those he sought vengeance against will not forgive him in return but will seek to destroy him, hard pressing his convictions.)
5. Or he might never actually repent but after grinding his foes into powder feel no satisfaction. (In which case he will probably commit suicide, which would be a very depressing ending but would make a point.)
6. Or or …Searching for more options. Estimated time remaining …
In the mean time, I’m longing for Cristo. I’ll pay him a second visit one of these days.
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Wow, good ideas, Daeus! That last one… that would be the most negative of negative character arches… I don’t know if I could take that…
But good ideas just the same. 🙂Now, I have another question. I’m sure you’re thrilled to hear it.
What about vengeance in a dystopian setting, where there is no law, and no justice? Who is to administer punishment on the evildoers? In such a setting as this, would it somehow be okay to PROMOTE the seeking of vengeance in the absence of government to bring retribution?
Well… I’ll enjoy Cristo for you in the meantime. Does that make you feel any better?
What? It’s not the same to do it by proxy?
humph
I’ll get back to you when I get back. Going to some conference thing. Dystopian? Hmmmm…
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I’ll hold you to that.
I’m back.
Well, where there is no justice there should be some. This is not to say that you should always force justice. When however you live in dystopia, it is probably time to set up your own government, even if it is a very small one. But let us say that won’t or hasn’t worked out. What then? First, it is interesting to note that the bible provides for a very limited and not entirely true to type form of vengeance. That is the avenger of blood. Not a bad system really. In fact Alfred the great used it though he modified some of the details to fit his nation and its ways. I wouldn’t say though that it is exactly vengeance. For one it is legal (was rather) legal and was appointed as such by Him who said,”vengeance is mine”. Second, it reeked no further wrath on the guilty man than what he had given. Now in a land where such an institution does not exist, there may be no sin in the avenger’s actions directly, but there may be because he will have brought only further wrath upon those he is trying to protect and in perhaps in that he has broken the law. Anyways, it would be unwise.
Besides that, there may be times for forming a resistance party or doing other sorts of uncommon things. Say for instance that I was in dystopia with a bit of an anarchical twist and someone stole my water purification system. I think I would try to take it back.
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Good thoughts. I especially like the idea of setting up your own small government in a dystopian world. That could be a thing— imagine a book with that as its plotline. A few devoted advocates for law in the midst of a vast sea of anarchy, struggling to bring some order without becoming as tyrannical as the anarchy they are trying to replace. I think that would be really cool.
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