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Oh, ay @kate-flournoy. Looks like Rolena tried to tag you but got one letter off. Thought I might as well fix it.
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Oh no! I knew I should have copied and pasted and not tried to type it! Sorry @kate-flournoy!
And thank you @daeus I often need a lot of fixin’.I must be off for now… but I shall return to the discussion at hand.
https://rolenahatfield.com/
Don’t worry, @rolena-hatfield, our name gets misspelled and mispronounced just like that ALL THE TIME. 😛 It is a little bit of an odd name. 😉
Yes, I’m loving this topic too. I can’t believe I didn’t introduce this discussion earlier!
As for the Bible question, there are many different ways you could do that correctly. Just base the scene off your own experiences.
Since the character (is this Kat, by the way?) hasn’t picked up her Bible in awhile, maybe you could show her reluctance to do it, and her guilt at that reluctance. Show us several times she sees the Bible, and almost picks it up, then decides against it. That way when she finally does pick it up, it will be much more powerful from a literary standpoint.
And ask yourself what drove her to do it after all. Maybe she picked it up looking for encouragement or justification. If that was the case, you could have it so she didn’t find the encouraging verses, but the verses she really needed to read. The verses that point out just exactly where she’s going wrong, and how she needs to fix it.
Reading the Bible is not always a pleasurable experience, after all. It can actually be quite painful, in my experience.In some books the characters revere the Bible with such unrealistic fervor— so much so that reading it is made out to be one continuous round of peace and joy and contentment. It’s almost like the author feels it will be heresy to have the character do anything but love the Bible to pieces.
And while I’ll not belittle the peace that can come of reading the Bible, it’s not realistic to have that be the only emotion it evokes.
It’s not the Bible that’s struggling and doubting— it’s the character.
The Bible has made miserable at times— made me angry, made me sad, made me doubt; made me ask myself painfully direct questions and be completely honest in a way that was certainly not peaceful or joyous.
Regardless of how you choose to do that scene, just focus on what you know from your own reading of the Bible.Yes @Daeus— I agree 100% with all your thoughts. What you said about the wishy washy character especially— you have to wonder, if those kinds of people really exist, wouldn’t they just as easily turn AWAY from Christianity at the first clever argument? Hey… that could be a character idea. Going from one religion to the next, always looking for the truth, never finding it until you realize what true ‘religion’ is.
And now I’ll go give myself a nosebleed trying to think of another facet to this discussion. 😛
ask yourself what drove her to do it after all. Maybe she picked it up looking for encouragement or justification. If that was the case, you could have it so she didn’t find the encouraging verses, but the verses she really needed to read.
Yeah that. Just forget whatever I said. I’ll see if I can come up with any more points too, only without getting a nosebleed. I’d rather get an idea eating frozen raspberries.
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Yes, that sounds far more pleasant.
Ah-ha! @kate-flournoy! This is why I love the forum! Your statement Show us several times she sees the Bible, and almost picks it up, then decides against it. I think is what I was missing. (And yes this is Katty’s story 🙂 lovely guess!) I did show her once, shying away from her Dad’s open Bible, but I don’t think that was quite enough to fuel the powerful statement I want to make when she does pick up her own Bible for the first time after ages. Also the statement that Daeus picked out was wonderful for this story. Thanks for the help. Also @daeus.
Alright so does anyone have any thoughts on Christian mentors in books? I was a bit of a rebel when it came to average reader likes and dislikes because I actually didn’t mind the mentor character who seemed to have their act together and helped the protagonist along in life. Maybe it’s because I always knew that the character is only human and I’m just not seeing the mentor’s mistakes in this story. Maybe it’s because I liked the example these mentors were to me.
But I also know that great mentors are honest about their past and their present struggles. Their life stories bear weight on the story of the person their mentoring. Their life long learning is being passed to a new generation with hopes that this generation will run the race with endurance avoiding the pitfalls and traps that they have been warned about, maybe ones that had caught and trapped the mentor in his younger years.So what makes a good scene with protagonist and a Christian mentor?
What are some things to avoid in these scenes?https://rolenahatfield.com/
Hey, I’m glad it was helpful @Rolena-Hatfield! 🙂
As for the mentor question, I’ve actually not studied that much… I’ll get back to you if I come up with any earthshaking conclusions. 😉
Great thoughts here.
I decided to have the existence of God as a given.I have few characters who take on a bit of the mentor role. They’re Christian’s but they certainly don’t have everything figured out. They’ve got their own struggles to deal with.
Alright alright, I admit it @everybody, I can’t stay off here forever.
I wanted to tell you all about this great example of christianity in fiction that I have been reading a about. It’s in this book I’m reading that’s a great piece of historical fiction focusing on the Waldensians. In this book there is one this one small town of waldensians up in the mountains that the inquisition has ordered completely whipped out. There is also this local ruler who is a leading the attacks against them to try to wipe them out. Finally, there are the inquisitors. There are more people of course, but these three are the most important for how christianity is displayed. I find the ruler who is trying to whip out the waldensians very fascinating. He himself is what we would immediately call an evil man. He thinks nothing of killing a man. He is treacherous, lecherous, cruel, and deceitful. What is interesting about him though, is that he actually has a great respect for the waldensians and especially their leader and he absolutely despises the inquisitors and would probably slaughter them if he could do so safely. He believes in God and has read the scriptures, but he does not believe in the inquisitor’s God. He takes ever opportunity to mock the inquisitors with the most stinging remarks about how they say but do not do, how the invent burdens, and do not cary them, how they pretend to be holy, but are seeking only worldly ends. Still, since he cannot disobey the inquisitors, he willingly sends his troops against the waldensians to obliterate them, and not just kill them, but make them suffer death to the upmost. It is something that does not mar his conscious and he does not appear to have one in the first place. He sees clearly that it is the waldensian’s faith that animates them, but he would rather find some way to destroy their faith than to join them in it, because then he might have the pleasure of seeing their destruction.
I find that through the lens of this fascinating character, the elements of christianity the author is displaying seem more real and appealing.
@Rolena-Hatfield I think christian mentors are fine so long as they don’t simplify the plot. I mean, the protagonist shouldn’t just be able to follow what the mentor says and save himself a tone of trouble.🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢🐢
@daeus- That sounds intriguing. What book is it?
@sarah-h It is called Rora. It is by James Byron Huggins.
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This is an excellent topic! Y’all should totally collaborate and submit an article for the website! 😀 “What We Awesome Forum People Say on the Subject of Christian Fiction” — it would literally be the coolest thing. 🙂
"When enemies attack your kingdom you don't flee you show them why it's your kingdom. With your lightsaber."
Isn’t that a little long for a title, @spradlin? 😉
Another thing I noticed about well done Christian fiction, while listening to Focus on the Family’s audio ‘Bonhoffer: The Cost of Freedom’, was… well, it’s a little difficult to put into words.
The conclusions Bonhoffer came to about the Bible, and Christianity, and the duty of a Christian versus the duty of a patriot, and all that, were kept open and up for debate. By which I mean, he changed his mind several times and kept amending his theories, as humans realistically will. There was never a clear ‘This is right— this is wrong’ laid down in black and white. The story was not… it was not the laying down of guidelines by which we ought to live our lives. It was not about what he discovered or what he thought— it was about how earnestly he sought the truth.
It was so inspiring, because even though he was a flawed, struggling human trying desperately to understand the mysteries of God and the intricacies of the Bible, he tried so hard to live as he ought.I guess what I’m trying to say is, it’s not necessarily about laying down perfect guidelines for Christianity, but about inspiring people to seek them out for themselves.
Does that make any sense whatsoever? 😛
Yes, it does makes sense @kate-flournoy 😉 And I completely agree. Nobody wants to be given a bunch of rules to follow *coughmecough* 😛 I think that portraying God’s love (rather than all the “rules”), even in stories, will inspire people to seek God. A lot of people, I believe, think of Christianity as a bunch of rules. But it’s SO much more than that! The Bible is a love story, from God to us. And I think if we show everyone God’s love in our stories, people will see that love shining through.
Okay, I’ll be quiet now. 😛 Can you tell I’m passionate about this topic? xD
Yes, that would be awesome! @spradlin
@kate-flournoy Yeah, that makes sense. Of course the bible does lay down a clear right vs. wrong, but I don’t think our job as fiction writers is so much to explain the bible (though absolutely avoiding that could cause serious problems) but more to make people excited about the bible and to want to follow it themselves.
If we are writing solely for christians, I think the dynamics might be significantly different, but I think a lot of us are trying to target a wider audience.
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