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Hey Whale, thanks for taking the time to explain! Yeah, I wasn’t looking for a lot, a simple few words to say your busy or something is better than simply disappearing inexplicably, so thanks for setting a moment of your time aside to say that.
I’m really sorry to hear about your mother. That’s really gotta be hard for your family. I actually know how you feel in that regard. My mom has suffered severe Septic episodes for the past decade, with countless trips to the hospital, everyone thinking she was in her death bed almost every time. Luckily, maybe 5 or so years ago (without the help of any doctors😑), we finally figured out the root cause, and we were able to make the needed changes to our lives. She still has issues, but it’s no longer life threatening, and she takes it all in stride.
I know that God loves you, your mother, and your family, and he will support you for your faith! If it is His will, He will preserve your mother! I’ll keep her in my prayers!
So although I have been commenting now and then, I really don’t have the mental energy to have a theological conversation. I’m sorry about avoiding the conversation, and next time I’ll warn you when I’m going to be “gone.” I guess I just didn’t want to explain.
I really relate to worrying you’ve offended someone, because I feel that way all the time. You have not offended me at all, just ruffled my Reformed feathers a bit😂
Totally get it, these sort of discussions can be very exhausting mentally. That will be very helpful for next time, that way I don’t have to waste mental energy being worried😅
Sorry to ruffle your reformed feathers against my restored feathers, now we just need to ruffle some unreformed feathers😂
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
Cool! I can’t wait to see how KP grows in your hands! I can’t really offer any comments or advice as far as finding a job, but I’ll give your prayers for that journey!
Thank you! And I will be praying that your mission goes well and that you touch many people’s lives with God’s word and light!
Christ gave Authority to Peter to build the Church. Said authority is a stressed concept both in the old and new testaments. What develops eventually is the Catholic Church, which claims to have the same authority as Peter. If your not Catholic, then my question would be how do you regard the concept of Authority. By not being Catholic, you denounce their authority, but now where’s your authority? So my question would be, does what it means to have Authority perhaps different from what both Catholic and LDS faiths think?
Yes! You would be correct in assuming I’m some sort of off-shoot of Protestant.
And to be frank, as the rebelious Protestant I am lol, I’m not a fan authority figures in the church. Power corrupts, and some of the most heavy and dangerous power you can have is claiming to be a mouth piece for God.
This extends to pastors, priests, popes, and even Christian authors, YouTubers, and bloggers.
How I think the church should operate, and how it started in the very early days, is a place of fellowship, community, and discussion.
Not a place where a singular or couple (often perverse and narcissistic) men take a deep, complex, ancient text and oversimplyify it to influence people to live and think the way they think is right, and shaming people who think otherwise.
This is why Jesus went so hard on the Heratics. He knew how destructive and dangerous it is for people to claim religious authority. People who not only misinterpret the Bible, but then take it a step further and misguide others with their pride and status.
I see many Christians like this. And it needs to be called out more in Christian communities.
So where is my authority? God. I take communion in Him through prayer, meditation, and studying the Bible. This doesn’t mean I don’t learn a lot from other Christians and theologians, but I never put them on a pedestal of authority. They, just like me, are just humans trying to learn and understand who God is.
I think this sentiment is consistent throughout the Bible. Humans trying to understand God and their unique stories on that journey.
I hope that answers your questions on my thoughts on religious authority! Basically, based on history, the Bible, and my own personal experiences, I’m very cynical towards anyone who claims to have some sort of authority in religion.
So if I may ask you a question in return, what are the foundational principles of the Book of Morman that me, as Protestant am missing out on? Why choose LDS over another branch of Christianity?
I might jump in on this conversation if you don’t mind. I wasn’t going to initially, but now that I’m reading it, it’s more intriguing.
I wouldn’t say I’m extremely cynical of authority figures in the church, but I have seen plenty of church leaders misleading people, some intentionally, some unintentionally, and I’m well aware of how much “church hurt” this has caused in our Western culture. I think God set church leadership in place to help guide the people, but I also think each person should take responsibility to seek God themselves and read the Bible, and not rely solely on a person for their discernment. We are all humans and capable of making mistakes, and that’s why I think it’s the heart posture that matters more than the position.
If a leader doesn’t first put the needs of the people first, there’s going to be mishandling, and it’s only going to become about their own fame, recognition, and status. They should be leading from a place of a healthy relationship with God. I think where we’ve gotten it wrong for so long is where we’ve made it about a person and a position, rather than seeking God together as one body.
I believe God can raise up leaders to help shepherd the flock, so to speak, but if they aren’t remaining accountable to God and to a team of leaders who can help them walk out a lifestyle of righteousness.
But again, I see @kathleenramm ‘s point of view, where self-proclaimed leaders overstep boundaries that were meant to be there for the safety of everyone involved. Looking to the examples set in the book of Acts, and the letters of the New Testament, is a great way to establish healthy leadership. It takes humility and servitude to lead well, and only when a leader is truly in submission to God first will they be able to lead other people without pride becoming an issue.
I’ve seen healthy examples of leaders in my life, and I’ve also seen my share of toxic ones. But as someone I know recently stated, “I can’t be a leader if I’m not first a follower.” I’m very thankful for the leaders in my life who have set a good example of what that looks like, but being under their leadership doesn’t negate the fact that I am under the authority of God first.
I hope that makes sense…. I think I’ll be done with my speech now. Someone else can take a turn. 🙂
"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
Thank you! And I will be praying that your mission goes well and that you touch many people’s lives with God’s word and light!
Thanks!😁
Yes! You would be correct in assuming I’m some sort of off-shoot of Protestant.
Good to know, thanks!
Thanks for joining the chat Trailblazer!
And to be frank, as the rebelious Protestant I am lol, I’m not a fan authority figures in the church. Power corrupts, and some of the most heavy and dangerous power you can have is claiming to be a mouth piece for God.
This extends to pastors, priests, popes, and even Christian authors, YouTubers, and bloggers.
How I think the church should operate, and how it started in the very early days, is a place of fellowship, community, and discussion.
That is an excellent point, and one we agree on for the most part. There are bad people in the world that will take advantage of good people by claiming to be God’s mouthpiece. I’m with you 100% on the idea that Church should be more discussion between those in the congregation as well. That’s actually how the LDS Church works. Instead of the same Pastor each week, we have members of the congregation bear their personal testimonies of Christ every Sunday.
I see your point, and I think it does apply to the view of Catholicism, and some other branches that claim absolute authority, where you have theocracies based more on money and control than real connection to God. This is what the LDS Church refers to as the Great Apostasy, where the Lord’s Authority was removed from the earth for a time, because of the unrighteous practices of those who originally were given that authority.
But my question then would be what about every single authority figure in the Bible, including Christ Himself. Every Prophet in the Old Testament were a single individual acting as God’s mouthpiece? Of course these were fallible men, having many recorded faults, but they still bore the authority to speak to God’s people on His behalf. By the Logic you gave, many of these individuals could be liars. And that’s actually a really good point. Who’s to say they aren’t? Any standard you say should be applied to one’s beliefs, should also be applied to your own. This even applies to Christ. Why should we trust anything that the scriptures say? Not everyone is an archeologist, historian, or logician that can nick pick all the details, not to mention that said details may be corrupted. Obviously our relationship with God has to be beyond that of just Scholarship. This is a tangent however, while one I would love to dive into if it interests you, I’ll get back to topic for now. If there are figures we regard as absolute authority in the Bible, Old Testament prophets, Apostles such as Paul, and even Christ, then why is there no such authority now? Paul was regarded as an authority, and he came after Christ, so what makes today different? I say this in good faith of course, a lot has happened since now and then, but what has happened that has changed that ideal of authority?
I’m not saying we should trust blindly, this is actually the same exact question about having faith in God. Do we trust blindly with faith? Some might say yes, some might say no. Personally, I prefer the latter, having faith in Christ is different from trusting blindly. Having trust in a latter day or early day authority, including the Bible, requires faith, even a scientific account requires some degree of trust from the readers, not having an absolute knowledge of how trustworthy the writer and the results may be.
My point is simply that while I agree that people have abused this system in the past, and will continue to do so today, that doesn’t mean we have to denounce the concept of Leadership, because without it, we have to denounce everything we’re built on in the first place. So it comes down to the question of faith. People can put their faith into things that are correct, and things that are not so correct, and this applies to the concept of authority, and everything else. So it comes down to what we put faith in, and why. Atheists tend to use arguments against theism along these lines, but they are blind to the fact that their world view is equally if not more fallible to this concept of what we put our faith in. We must come to a knowledge for ourselves, whether the source bear good or bad fruit. That knowledge comes from the Spirit, that testifies of truth. Yes, I believe in modern day authority, in multiple figures including President Nelson, the current Prophet of the Church (multiple individuals instead of one can also be helpful for this sort of problem), but I also believe that the Spirit is the absolute authority, which is what tells me that said authority, including the Bible, is really God’s word.
I really hope that didn’t feel like a bash. That’s my winded way of essentially asking why we don’t have prophets anymore🤣 Which was what I was getting at with the idea of Authority, I hope I clarified a bit more of what I’m really asking. Your make amazing points, God is the absolute Authority, we can all appreciate that. I believe with everything I am that God is a personal God, that religion as a concept can lead to corruption and disconnect from God if it replaces spirituality, however we can’t just remove religion in favor of spirituality, we need both, at least that’s how I currently feel, and that could change, though I doubt it.
I hope that answers your questions on my thoughts on religious authority! Basically, based on history, the Bible, and my own personal experiences, I’m very cynical towards anyone who claims to have some sort of authority in religion.
That’s very fair. I can’t tell you your personal experience is wrong anymore than you can tell me that mine is wrong, Our perception of reality is real and personal. While we can agree that there is objective truth, we are all fallible humans trying to figure out how to be closer to God, and that’s gonna look different for everyone, so the best we can really do is be humble on that journey. Please do be skeptical of anyone who claims to have some sort of authority in religion, it is a healthy habit, but I do ask you to consider this, what were the Scribes and Pharisees doing when Christ came to say He was the Son of Man?
So if I may ask you a question in return, what are the foundational principles of the Book of Morman that me, as Protestant am missing out on? Why choose LDS over another branch of Christianity?
Great question! Well, for one thing, I would say clarity. God is not a God of chaos. All the different sects of Christianity seem to have wildly different ideas on salvation, despite saying they agree on a core saving doctrine. Things like baptism, predestination, grace and works, good and evil, ect, things that make wildly different understandings of Christ’s mission and purpose, as well as how we are even saved. Many Protestant churches seem to be far more open minded, whereas others make it clear on how one can and cannot be saved, despite both agreeing on said core doctrine. The Book of Mormon, as well as Doctrine & Covenants, and The Pearl of a Great Price, all affirm the truths of the Bible, testifying of it, but also explains Christ’s doctrine in a restored light, as it once was, and explains so much more. In 3rd Nephi, Christ explains his doctrine as follows:
31 Behold, verily, verily, I say unto you, I will declare unto you my doctrine.
32 And this is my doctrine, and it is the doctrine which the Father hath given unto me; and I bear record of the Father, and the Father beareth record of me, and the Holy Ghost beareth record of the Father and me; and I bear record that the Father commandeth all men, everywhere, to repent and believe in me.
33 And whoso believeth in me, and is baptized, the same shall be saved; and they are they who shall inherit the kingdom of God.
34 And whoso believeth not in me, and is not baptized, shall be damned.
35 Verily, verily, I say unto you, that this is my doctrine, and I bear record of it from the Father; and whoso believeth in me believeth in the Father also; and unto him will the Father bear record of me, for he will visit him with fire and with the Holy Ghost.
36 And thus will the Father bear record of me, and the Holy Ghost will bear record unto him of the Father and me; for the Father, and I, and the Holy Ghost are one.
37 And again I say unto you, ye must repent, and become as a little child, and be baptized in my name, or ye can in nowise receive these things.
38 And again I say unto you, ye must repent, and be baptized in my name, and become as a little child, or ye can in nowise inherit the kingdom of God.
39 Verily, verily, I say unto you, that this is my doctrine, and whoso buildeth upon this buildeth upon my rock, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against them.
So in short:
-Faith in Christ
-Repentance
-Baptism in the name of Christ
-And humility likened unto a child
This is simple, and straight forward. You of course will likely agree with all with maybe maybe not the exception of the one on Baptism. However, many people I’ve had discussions with seem to reject even the first principle, saying we need to ‘prove’ Christ, removing the concept of faith altogether. The Book of Mormon essentially gives us clarity of Christ’s mission, and our purpose here on earth. Many people as you have pointed out have sought to control other’s beliefs, which is what has lead to so many different views and opinions, but they obviously can’t all be correct. As you’ve pointed out, God’s authority is the ultimate authority, so that’s why we need things like additional scripture, as well as modern day revelation and authority, so that God can express His authority in the same way he has since the beginning.
I’ll summarize my return questions.
By authority, what I really meant is why we no longer have Prophets?
What’s the difference between rejecting prophets now, and rejecting Christ in his day?
How do we trust anything we put our faith in? (if you want to get into it)
This one I think is interesting, but you don’t have to answer it, because it is heavy. My faith says you’ll be saved, but if my Church isn’t true, am I saved?
Honestly Trail, I love everything you’ve said. I agree 100%, and could not say anything better. I do have a question though.
I believe God can raise up leaders to help shepherd the flock, so to speak, but if they aren’t remaining accountable to God and to a team of leaders who can help them walk out a lifestyle of righteousness.
Absolutely! So do you think that God may still have prophets on the earth then, or just good leaders in general, in the forms of honest Pastors and such?
Can’t wait to hear y’all’s thoughts, I’m glad we can have these discussions with love and respect for one another!
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
Absolutely! So do you think that God may still have prophets on the earth then, or just good leaders in general, in the forms of honest Pastors and such?
Haha, so this might open up a can of worms, because I know there’s a big argument about this, but I do believe there are still prophets on the earth. This is a topic I’ve been diving into more thoroughly over the past couple years, focusing especially on the early church in the Bible.
From what I have learned, I believe there are five types of leadership that God designed for the church (you may have heard this referred to as the five-fold ministry)- apostles, prophets, pastors, teachers, and evangelists. I think God designed them to work together and balance each other out, and something I’ve been wondering lately is perhaps a lot of the dysfunction we see in the church is a result of A, not having proper balance, and B, not understanding the different roles and in turn, bashing other people because they’re different, when in reality, God didn’t create us all to function in the same gifts and callings. I can dive into each of the five roles a little more if you want, but that’s the gist of what I believe.
I’m also glad we can discuss this in a respectful way! I wish more people were willing to have discussions where we listen to each other’s point of views and try to understand instead of immediately writing each other off.
"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
!!!
That’s so cool!!! Me too! I haven’t heard of the five fold ministry before, but it makes perfect sense. That’s actually very close if not identical to how The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints is organized, just with some different terminology!
We have a prophet: President Russel M. Nelson, bearing all priesthood keys to direct and receive revelation for the Church.
We have 12 apostles: M. Russell Ballard, Jeffrey R. Holland, Dieter F. Uchtdorf, David A. Bednar, Quentin L. Cook, D. Todd Christofferson, Neil L. Andersen, Ronald A. Rasband, Gary E. Stevenson, Dale G. Renlund, Gerrit W. Gong, and Ulisses Soares.
We have pastors, but we call them Bishops.
We have Evangelists, but we call them Missionaries (that’s me for two years starting soon!)
And I don’t know about teachers. There’s probably several analogues to whatever specific definition of teacher you might be using. What is a teacher in this context?
I would love to dive deeper into each with you! This is really interesting!
I’m also glad we can discuss this in a respectful way! I wish more people were willing to have discussions where we listen to each other’s point of views and try to understand instead of immediately writing each other off.
Imagine what the world would be like if everyone simply, you know, loved one another as Christ loves us. Maybe someday😃
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
Ok give me a sec… I wrote out a lengthy reply and then as soon as I hit submit, KP logged me out and I lost the post… ARGH! I’m gonna try to remember everything I said.
"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
First off, I never knew LDS was structured that way! That’s interesting!
Now, to get into the five-fold ministry: I think what’s confusing about the teacher role is that many churches in America have pastors teaching every Sunday, and the roles have almost been used interchangeably, but I’ll try to explain the difference. (Keep in mind that the roles as I’m referring to them are the way God wired and designed people, and the way Holy Spirit works through them, and not necessarily the titles people have placed on them, or in some cases, they’ve placed on themselves.)
The teacher: Usually more intellectual, they’re the ones who enjoy deep studies and passing on the knowledge they gain to others. They’re good at breaking subjects down for people to understand.
The pastor: They have a heart for the people. Think of a shepherd, who cares for, looks after, protects, and guides the flock. The heart of a pastor is to nurture and look after the wellbeing of the people under their care.
The evangelist: With a passion for sharing the Gospel with those who do not yet know Jesus, the evangelist is the one in pursuit of the lost (for lack of a better term). They’re usually on the move, because once they’ve succeeded, they’re on to the next person. Discipleship doesn’t come as naturally to them; I believe this is why the pastor and the evangelist need to work together more often.
The prophet: This is the one receiving revelation, direction, and correction from God for the body of Christ. They’re more in tune with the supernatural.
The apostle: The apostle is the visionary, the one with the capacity to see ways of building and expanding the kingdom of God. I’ve also heard the role of the apostle compared to the thumb; just as the thumb can touch all the other fingers, so the apostle can also function in the other roles, which is why it can be harder to distinguish an apostle from the rest.
That’s a basic summary; I’m still learning more about the different roles, too. I also want to add that there are aspects of each role that anyone can operate in. For example, just because there’s the office of a prophet, it doesn’t mean that the rest of the body of Christ can’t also receive revelation, or have dreams or visions from God. Just because there’s the office of an evangelist, that doesn’t mean others can’t be involved in missions. What I’ve noticed is that often, each person has one or two of the five functions that they’re strongest in (similar to personality tests), but because the same Holy Spirit is working through each person, there’s the capability of operating in any of the other roles when the occasion or need arises.
I hope that makes sense!
@kathleenramm I’d love to hear your thoughts as well!"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
Ok give me a sec… I wrote out a lengthy reply and then as soon as I hit submit, KP logged me out and I lost the post… ARGH! I’m gonna try to remember everything I said.
That has happened an embarrassing amount of times to me, and often with 5 page long rants I had to re-type! It took me a while to make a habit of making sure I was signed in😅
First off, I never knew LDS was structured that way! That’s interesting!
Yep! It is my personal conviction that it is the restored Gospel, so it only makes sense in my eyes that it would follow that structure as Paul noted. Even if it isn’t the restored Gospel, it has borne good fruit.
Now, to get into the five-fold ministry: I think what’s confusing about the teacher role is that many churches in America have pastors teaching every Sunday, and the roles have almost been used interchangeably, but I’ll try to explain the difference. (Keep in mind that the roles as I’m referring to them are the way God wired and designed people, and the way Holy Spirit works through them, and not necessarily the titles people have placed on them, or in some cases, they’ve placed on themselves.)
Yeah, so in the LDS structure, the bishop (pastor) might teach, but only occasionally, and also depends on the size of the congregation. During the first hour of Church, 2 to 3 different people from the congregation are asked to give a sermon (unless it’s the first Sunday of the month, in which case, anyone that wants to can come bear their testimony), then the second hour everyone separates into their classes, which would have teachers. Said teachers would actually be called and set apart for this position, just like the others, it took me a moment to recognize that for some reason, because ‘teacher’ seemed like such a blanket term, but it literally means what it literally means. The Gospel is beautiful in its simplicity.
The evangelist: With a passion for sharing the Gospel with those who do not yet know Jesus, the evangelist is the one in pursuit of the lost (for lack of a better term). They’re usually on the move, because once they’ve succeeded, they’re on to the next person. Discipleship doesn’t come as naturally to them; I believe this is why the pastor and the evangelist need to work together more often.
Why does discipleship not come as easy to evangelists? Discipleship essentially means to have a personal relationship with Christ, so to evangelize seems to be almost synonymous with that. You can’t be a good missionary, unless you are a good disciple, right?
That’s a basic summary; I’m still learning more about the different roles, too. I also want to add that there are aspects of each role that anyone can operate in. For example, just because there’s the office of a prophet, it doesn’t mean that the rest of the body of Christ can’t also receive revelation, or have dreams or visions from God. Just because there’s the office of an evangelist, that doesn’t mean others can’t be involved in missions. What I’ve noticed is that often, each person has one or two of the five functions that they’re strongest in (similar to personality tests), but because the same Holy Spirit is working through each person, there’s the capability of operating in any of the other roles when the occasion or need arises.
I hope that makes sense!
Makes sense to me! I also believe in personal revelation, as well as the revelation given by the Prophet, and I’ve personally been working with my local Sister Missionaries in preparation for my Mission, and a friend of mine, having already served his mission, still loves going out with the local Missionaries to preach the word. It just makes sense. As far as it being almost a sort of personality test sort of thing, I can see where your going with that, though I feel like that works better with the idea of spiritual gifts. Though that would heavily influence the 5 fold anyway.
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
Why does discipleship not come as easy to evangelists? Discipleship essentially means to have a personal relationship with Christ, so to evangelize seems to be almost synonymous with that. You can’t be a good missionary, unless you are a good disciple, right?
Ok, so first, here’s the definition according to Dictionary.com: “the condition or situation of being a disciple, a follower, or a student of some philosophy, especially a follower of Christ.” So yes, discipleship in one sense is being a follower of Jesus. However, as I was trying to use it, I meant the follow-up beyond salvation. This example probably won’t apply as much to LDS, since you have a different method of evangelism, but I’ve seen meetings and events where people accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior, but then when they walk out, they’re not connected with a church or other believers, and it’s easy for them to quickly fall away from their faith. Personally, I believe it’s important to connect new believers to a church or community of believers where they can grow in their faith- where they can be discipled by other people who are following Christ. In essence, that’s what I was trying to say by using discipleship- being discipled by others who have been walking with Jesus longer than they have and will assist them in their spiritual growth. Since the evangelist is focused on reaching people with the Gospel, they aren’t as likely to stay and disciple the new believers (although if they partner with churches and help the new believers make the initial connection, then the pastors and church community can take it from there). Does that make more sense?
"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
Ohhh, ok. So what your saying is that the evangelist themself doesn’t have a problem with personally being a disciple, but may have trouble helping others reach discipleship, because they can usually only deliver the message. Am I getting that right? That would make a lot more sense, and is actually how LDS Missionaries function. Friendship is indeed one of the aspects of missionary work, but missionaries usually only have 6 weeks in a transfer, and therefore it is high priority to help those they teach feel comfortable with the local congregation, so that they won’t just drop it once the missionaries leave.
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
Yes, that’s essentially what I was getting at.
"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
Ok, well great! Thanks for clarifying that. So that’s really cool that my faith has analogues to that system, but I haven’t heard of any others that have modern day prophets and Apostles. Is there any particular individuals you believe are called Prophets that you follow, or some particular sect with this five fold structure in practice?
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
You probably haven’t heard much about it because you won’t see it in the major denominations. From what I’ve seen, it’s primarily in the nondenominational churches, and it’s been something that has been brought back more in the past 50 to 70 years. There are a number of Christians who don’t believe the roles of the apostle and prophet are still active today, but in the research and study I’ve done, I haven’t seen evidence to support that. Of course, there would be people who would argue with me on that, and it’s fine if they believe differently, but this is from my experience and personal study.
I don’t normally like to list names because when I do people start writing me off for listening to certain people. Unfortunately, people start picking up stones and slandering others for saying things they don’t agree with. Of course, there are also people I don’t agree with, but it’s not my place to publicly slander them or gossip, because that only causes more harm than good, regardless of whether my opinion is right or wrong.
But anyway, bunny trail aside, I will mention one ministry I follow called ElijahStreams. Steve Shultz, the founder, hosts a show five days a week where he interviews different prophets (and occasionally other people) to help listeners get a glimpse of what God is speaking to them. Not all of his guests would call themselves prophets, although many listeners would probably consider them to be. Now, do I agree with everything all of his guests share? No, not always, and that’s okay. It allows me to hear different perspectives, and I can take what I’m hearing back to God and ask Him myself for clarity.
That said, there are other names I don’t really follow very much, but I know other people who do, and others who would consider them prophets- Sid Roth also has a show, and Chuck Pierce has been considered an apostle.
I don’t know how much that answers your question, but there you go lol.
"Real love is for your good, not for your comfort." -Justin Whitmel Earley
You probably haven’t heard much about it because you won’t see it in the major denominations. From what I’ve seen, it’s primarily in the nondenominational churches, and it’s been something that has been brought back more in the past 50 to 70 years. There are a number of Christians who don’t believe the roles of the apostle and prophet are still active today, but in the research and study I’ve done, I haven’t seen evidence to support that. Of course, there would be people who would argue with me on that, and it’s fine if they believe differently, but this is from my experience and personal study.
That makes sense, my Church is usually slandered for believing in modern day prophets, so it makes sense that smaller denominations that try to suggest the idea are either ignored or snuffed out by mainstream Christianity.
I don’t normally like to list names because when I do people start writing me off for listening to certain people. Unfortunately, people start picking up stones and slandering others for saying things they don’t agree with. Of course, there are also people I don’t agree with, but it’s not my place to publicly slander them or gossip, because that only causes more harm than good, regardless of whether my opinion is right or wrong.
That’s a very fair concern. I’m used to seeing slander and gossip towards the prophet and apostles of my Church. It’s really unavoidable for them. Christ did say to remember that He was hated before any of those who followed Him. That doesn’t mean we should give those who hate us that liberty to beat us down if it can be helped. In many cases, these are mainstream individuals who’s names can’t escape the internet, but those who have not yet gone there should seriously consider if that’s what God intends for them before trying to enter the system.
As for those you have mentioned, I’ll have to check them out. It would be interesting to hear those different views as you pointed out. Personally, I believe that truth can be found everywhere, and everyone has the ability to receive revelation, and therefore you can find truth from them. Though I would also be skeptical if anyone did claim to be a prophet, and therefore be able to receive revelation and authority for others, but skeptical doesn’t mean not open minded. I would tackle it in the same manner as you pointed out, after hearing something, just pray about it, ask God whether this be good or evil.
It’s so cool that there’s all these similarities!
So what would you say are your thoughts on authority then? As I see it, it is immensely biblical. Do you believe authority has still been preserved for for the past 2000 years? Or do you view it in a different light and/or emphasis?
He is perfect in Justice, yet He is perfect in Mercy, even when we fail Him. For this, He is good.
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